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	<title>Comments for Quakernomics</title>
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	<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog</link>
	<description>Seeking a fair economy for people and planet</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:13:41 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on “The first priority must be to restore robust economic growth …&#8221; by Frokostordning</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/%e2%80%9cthe-first-priority-must-be-to-restore-robust-economic-growth-%e2%80%a6/comment-page-1/#comment-167</link>
		<dc:creator>Frokostordning</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 04:13:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=979#comment-167</guid>
		<description>Well... that&#039;s amazing but frankly i have a hard time seeing it...  wonder what others have to say..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well&#8230; that&#8217;s amazing but frankly i have a hard time seeing it&#8230;  wonder what others have to say..</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Robin Hood Tax by David Millar</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/campaigns/the-robin-hood-tax/comment-page-1/#comment-153</link>
		<dc:creator>David Millar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2010 15:46:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=971#comment-153</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t know this was called &quot;Robin Hood&quot;. I know it as the Tobin tax (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobin_tax) which a French group ATTAC has pushed for. Recently backed by Brown and Sarkoszy, fiercely opposed by US govt, Wall St and the City -- which makes me think that if the financial elites hate it so much, it might actually work, deterring speculators as well as generating revenue for climate mitigation abroad and social justice at home. So far I do not see much public awareness or pressure; maybe they will come. See this article by a respected financial journalist:
http://www.globeadvisor.com/servlet/ArticleNews/story/gam/20091030/ROBMAGNOVEMBERPG20</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t know this was called &#8220;Robin Hood&#8221;. I know it as the Tobin tax (<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobin_tax" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobin_tax</a>) which a French group ATTAC has pushed for. Recently backed by Brown and Sarkoszy, fiercely opposed by US govt, Wall St and the City &#8212; which makes me think that if the financial elites hate it so much, it might actually work, deterring speculators as well as generating revenue for climate mitigation abroad and social justice at home. So far I do not see much public awareness or pressure; maybe they will come. See this article by a respected financial journalist:<br />
<a href="http://www.globeadvisor.com/servlet/ArticleNews/story/gam/20091030/ROBMAGNOVEMBERPG20" rel="nofollow">http://www.globeadvisor.com/servlet/ArticleNews/story/gam/20091030/ROBMAGNOVEMBERPG20</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on ‘The Big Swap’ Fairtrade Fortnight, 22 February – 7 March 2010 by Shared Interest</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/campaigns/%e2%80%98the-big-swap%e2%80%99-fairtrade-fortnight-22-february-%e2%80%93-7-march-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-152</link>
		<dc:creator>Shared Interest</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 16:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=876#comment-152</guid>
		<description>Hi,

Love the Quakernomics website. 

Would it be possible for you to post our fairtrade fortnight video onto your page on fairtrade fortnight(http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/campaigns/%E2%80%98the-big-swap%E2%80%99-fairtrade-fortnight-22-february-%E2%80%93-7-march-2010/)
our video is available at: 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O1L-o9FK1Y

Regards,
Adam</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>Love the Quakernomics website. </p>
<p>Would it be possible for you to post our fairtrade fortnight video onto your page on fairtrade fortnight(http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/campaigns/%E2%80%98the-big-swap%E2%80%99-fairtrade-fortnight-22-february-%E2%80%93-7-march-2010/)<br />
our video is available at:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O1L-o9FK1Y" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_O1L-o9FK1Y</a></p>
<p>Regards,<br />
Adam</p>
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		<title>Comment on A New Paradigm by Dave Milner</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/a-new-paradigm/comment-page-1/#comment-148</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Milner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Feb 2010 13:31:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=927#comment-148</guid>
		<description>IN terms of the paradigm shifts mentioned in the initial theread I think these are qualitatively different from what we are dealing with here. Both those science based shifts were at a time when academics and academic thought were the concern of a relatively few people in society - there were no mass media to involve the general population. Those concerned were operating at a level for themselves. Secondly these shifts were not about social change, though they did lead to change. 
I think a more relevant issue is not quite a paradigm shift but the way in which the free market ideas apparently triumphed in the 1980s. These ideas were not just academic concerns but were related to the actual and real organisation of society and the structures within it.
The political expression of Thatcherism and Reaganism and the concomitant liberalisation of markets  were underpinned and based on academic and analytical ideas from the likes of Hayek and Friedman. These ideas were promulgated by a series of think tank, research institutes and university departments in a coherent fashion designed to change the mindset of academics and opinion formers. The fact that these ideas suited large corporations was a real bonus to getting them into law, govt policy and concrete forms but the real battle was in the minds of informed people who became convinced about liberalisation and free markets. Once this was achieved the poilitcal consequences followed - ideas preceeded action.
The paradigm shift a lot of us are after does not so far have this coherence and singleminded approach of those free marketeers. We are handicapped because our views challenge the existing structures of power, both political and economic. Our movement is also disparate with many aims and analyses. These are strengths of course but also militate against a paradigm shift.
Marxism in the 19th century also had ideas which underpinned actions. The gaia hypothesis underpinned a lot of changing thought but has now run its course.
I don&#039;t know an answer but we are all looking for one unifying thoughtn process to bring us together.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IN terms of the paradigm shifts mentioned in the initial theread I think these are qualitatively different from what we are dealing with here. Both those science based shifts were at a time when academics and academic thought were the concern of a relatively few people in society &#8211; there were no mass media to involve the general population. Those concerned were operating at a level for themselves. Secondly these shifts were not about social change, though they did lead to change.<br />
I think a more relevant issue is not quite a paradigm shift but the way in which the free market ideas apparently triumphed in the 1980s. These ideas were not just academic concerns but were related to the actual and real organisation of society and the structures within it.<br />
The political expression of Thatcherism and Reaganism and the concomitant liberalisation of markets  were underpinned and based on academic and analytical ideas from the likes of Hayek and Friedman. These ideas were promulgated by a series of think tank, research institutes and university departments in a coherent fashion designed to change the mindset of academics and opinion formers. The fact that these ideas suited large corporations was a real bonus to getting them into law, govt policy and concrete forms but the real battle was in the minds of informed people who became convinced about liberalisation and free markets. Once this was achieved the poilitcal consequences followed &#8211; ideas preceeded action.<br />
The paradigm shift a lot of us are after does not so far have this coherence and singleminded approach of those free marketeers. We are handicapped because our views challenge the existing structures of power, both political and economic. Our movement is also disparate with many aims and analyses. These are strengths of course but also militate against a paradigm shift.<br />
Marxism in the 19th century also had ideas which underpinned actions. The gaia hypothesis underpinned a lot of changing thought but has now run its course.<br />
I don&#8217;t know an answer but we are all looking for one unifying thoughtn process to bring us together.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Equality, prosperity and growth: where do we stand? Thursday 4th March, London by Equality, prosperity and growth event &#171; Beyond Growth</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/events/equality-prosperity-and-growth-where-do-we-stand/comment-page-1/#comment-147</link>
		<dc:creator>Equality, prosperity and growth event &#171; Beyond Growth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Feb 2010 13:00:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=964#comment-147</guid>
		<description>[...] more, see the Quakernomics blog. Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)Book review: Prosperity Without Growth, by Tim [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] more, see the Quakernomics blog. Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)Book review: Prosperity Without Growth, by Tim [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on A New Paradigm by Julia Lim</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/a-new-paradigm/comment-page-1/#comment-139</link>
		<dc:creator>Julia Lim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jan 2010 20:53:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=927#comment-139</guid>
		<description>In relation to possible new paradigm, I have been mulling over a section in the final chapter of The Spirit Level, Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett&#039;s great book about the known but unacknowledged effects of economic inequality. 
The final chapter, Building The Future, starts to look at a number of suggestions to reduce inequality and thus address the resulting social ills, and considers among other things the impact of technological and digital advances on marginal costs, so that once the initial outlay has been made the costs of further production are minimal. 

They say &quot;once the capital cost has been incurred, the more people sharing the benefits the better&quot; - a simple statement but one profoundly divergent from the ethos behind econocapitalism - to the extent that I read it, had to re-read it, and thought &quot;how on earth would that work?&quot;
 Later on they say: &quot;From the point of view of society as a a whole, the tendency for technological change to reduce marginal costs is rapidly tipping the balance away from allowing profit-maximising corporations to to control the distribution of goods. Increasingly they can only rely on the remnants of monopolistic power provided by patents or copyright. We need to find new ways to pay organisations and individuals for life-enhancing research, creativity and innovation - the geese which lay the golden eggs - which does not then restrict access to the benefits.&quot;

In terms of paradigm shift, I&#039;m also thinking of Michael Sandel&#039;s 2009 Reith Lectures and how they deconstructed the science of (capitalist) economics to show that something that was intended as a tool to assist  government and the understanding of social issues has become the dominant, almost religiously exclusive, rationale for deciding on and evaluating any particular policy direction. These can still be accessed on the BBC website.

There was also a recent edition of Resurgence magazine devoted entirely to the theme of money and concepts of money and finance that has interesting references.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In relation to possible new paradigm, I have been mulling over a section in the final chapter of The Spirit Level, Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett&#8217;s great book about the known but unacknowledged effects of economic inequality.<br />
The final chapter, Building The Future, starts to look at a number of suggestions to reduce inequality and thus address the resulting social ills, and considers among other things the impact of technological and digital advances on marginal costs, so that once the initial outlay has been made the costs of further production are minimal. </p>
<p>They say &#8220;once the capital cost has been incurred, the more people sharing the benefits the better&#8221; &#8211; a simple statement but one profoundly divergent from the ethos behind econocapitalism &#8211; to the extent that I read it, had to re-read it, and thought &#8220;how on earth would that work?&#8221;<br />
 Later on they say: &#8220;From the point of view of society as a a whole, the tendency for technological change to reduce marginal costs is rapidly tipping the balance away from allowing profit-maximising corporations to to control the distribution of goods. Increasingly they can only rely on the remnants of monopolistic power provided by patents or copyright. We need to find new ways to pay organisations and individuals for life-enhancing research, creativity and innovation &#8211; the geese which lay the golden eggs &#8211; which does not then restrict access to the benefits.&#8221;</p>
<p>In terms of paradigm shift, I&#8217;m also thinking of Michael Sandel&#8217;s 2009 Reith Lectures and how they deconstructed the science of (capitalist) economics to show that something that was intended as a tool to assist  government and the understanding of social issues has become the dominant, almost religiously exclusive, rationale for deciding on and evaluating any particular policy direction. These can still be accessed on the BBC website.</p>
<p>There was also a recent edition of Resurgence magazine devoted entirely to the theme of money and concepts of money and finance that has interesting references.</p>
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		<title>Comment on thoughts after Copenhagen by david  dunn</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/thoughts-after-copenhagen-2/comment-page-1/#comment-137</link>
		<dc:creator>david  dunn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Jan 2010 18:52:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=920#comment-137</guid>
		<description>You hit the nail on the head, but we need to tax carbon at source to replace all other taxes to make any real change in the mindset of people .

Money talks !!!!!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You hit the nail on the head, but we need to tax carbon at source to replace all other taxes to make any real change in the mindset of people .</p>
<p>Money talks !!!!!!!!</p>
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		<title>Comment on ‘The Big Swap’ Fairtrade Fortnight, 22 February – 7 March 2010 by suzannei</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/campaigns/%e2%80%98the-big-swap%e2%80%99-fairtrade-fortnight-22-february-%e2%80%93-7-march-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-134</link>
		<dc:creator>suzannei</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Jan 2010 16:37:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=876#comment-134</guid>
		<description>The Fairtrade Foundation has just released a number of useful resouces for Fairtrade Fortnight.  These include a Church Action Guide, School&#039;s Action Guide, posters and ideas for &#039;swaps&#039;.  You can download these here:

http://www.fairtrade.org.uk/thebigswap/the_big_swap_needs_you.aspx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Fairtrade Foundation has just released a number of useful resouces for Fairtrade Fortnight.  These include a Church Action Guide, School&#8217;s Action Guide, posters and ideas for &#8217;swaps&#8217;.  You can download these here:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.fairtrade.org.uk/thebigswap/the_big_swap_needs_you.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://www.fairtrade.org.uk/thebigswap/the_big_swap_needs_you.aspx</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on A New Paradigm by cynthia dereli</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/a-new-paradigm/comment-page-1/#comment-131</link>
		<dc:creator>cynthia dereli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jan 2010 17:02:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=927#comment-131</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t resist the challenge  from &#039;Flying Stag&#039; – so here are some thoughts  on issues and reading!!

I have finally got around to reading Arblaster&#039;s book on liberalism. It is really challenging. It is great in pointing up from nineteenth century sources just how amoral  the idea of growth was in its origins and then linking this to the development of neoliberalism as a resurgence of those early 19th century ideas. A new book by Serge Latouche  &#039;A Farewell to Growth&#039;  seems to be bringing it all together – I say &#039;seems&#039; because I haven&#039;t quite finished reading it. So far there is a lot about &#039;the local&#039;  and I&#039;m hoping he will get on to   what needs to be done at the global level to support this. 
To me it seems that this is all about putting equality first in all our thinking  along with ethics, because these two all important features of human life have been sadly missing from the development of political ideas over the last century. When we thought our society was making progress in this direction it was fundamentally still locked into those early 19th century assumptions of elites and power and disposable poor,... perhaps fundamentally through &#039;economics&#039; as a discipline?

If economics and the corporations are part of the problem then let&#039;s  for instance change the legal constitution of the corporation. David Korten who has been writing about globalisation for some time now focuses on this on his web site. Hertie School of Governance  have  a paper on adding human rights responsibilities to obligations of corporations to allow people to sue them under Human rights legislation (lots of other sources there) and I found on the web something on NGO Alternative Treaties  on the UN web site for 2002 Sustainability summit... so these ideas are around.  Any more suggestions?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t resist the challenge  from &#8216;Flying Stag&#8217; – so here are some thoughts  on issues and reading!!</p>
<p>I have finally got around to reading Arblaster&#8217;s book on liberalism. It is really challenging. It is great in pointing up from nineteenth century sources just how amoral  the idea of growth was in its origins and then linking this to the development of neoliberalism as a resurgence of those early 19th century ideas. A new book by Serge Latouche  &#8216;A Farewell to Growth&#8217;  seems to be bringing it all together – I say &#8217;seems&#8217; because I haven&#8217;t quite finished reading it. So far there is a lot about &#8216;the local&#8217;  and I&#8217;m hoping he will get on to   what needs to be done at the global level to support this.<br />
To me it seems that this is all about putting equality first in all our thinking  along with ethics, because these two all important features of human life have been sadly missing from the development of political ideas over the last century. When we thought our society was making progress in this direction it was fundamentally still locked into those early 19th century assumptions of elites and power and disposable poor,&#8230; perhaps fundamentally through &#8216;economics&#8217; as a discipline?</p>
<p>If economics and the corporations are part of the problem then let&#8217;s  for instance change the legal constitution of the corporation. David Korten who has been writing about globalisation for some time now focuses on this on his web site. Hertie School of Governance  have  a paper on adding human rights responsibilities to obligations of corporations to allow people to sue them under Human rights legislation (lots of other sources there) and I found on the web something on NGO Alternative Treaties  on the UN web site for 2002 Sustainability summit&#8230; so these ideas are around.  Any more suggestions?</p>
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		<title>Comment on thoughts after Copenhagen by Tony Weekes</title>
		<link>http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/zero-growth-economy/thoughts-after-copenhagen-2/comment-page-1/#comment-125</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Weekes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Dec 2009 12:09:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.quakerweb.org.uk/blog/?p=920#comment-125</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right, Cyn: &quot;If citizens keep up the pressure perhaps eventually government will catch up.&quot;  But I find myself in some despair about the sheer level of ignorance (I use the term descriptively, not pejoratively). Periodicals like the Ethical Consumer are still not as well known (and used!) as they should be.  The level of political debate, as we approach the 2010 general election, is appallingly bad.  Did those who struggled for universal suffrage struggle in vain?
One hope lies with us (as Quakers)? But I am still not sure we have grasped the implications of Boulding&#039;s Backhouse lecture (see the brief quote in my blog contribution - now some weeks ago!)
WAKE UP, FRIENDS!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right, Cyn: &#8220;If citizens keep up the pressure perhaps eventually government will catch up.&#8221;  But I find myself in some despair about the sheer level of ignorance (I use the term descriptively, not pejoratively). Periodicals like the Ethical Consumer are still not as well known (and used!) as they should be.  The level of political debate, as we approach the 2010 general election, is appallingly bad.  Did those who struggled for universal suffrage struggle in vain?<br />
One hope lies with us (as Quakers)? But I am still not sure we have grasped the implications of Boulding&#8217;s Backhouse lecture (see the brief quote in my blog contribution &#8211; now some weeks ago!)<br />
WAKE UP, FRIENDS!!!!</p>
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